Some possible Edit Audio Regions improvements

jamsden

I find it quite tedious to edit audio regions. Starting and stopping playback requires me to use the mouse and move out of the regions where I am editing. The play head unexpectedly jumps back or starts looping while I'm trying to listen to the song to add regions.

Consider:

Using Space bar for Play/Stop as in other views
Don't do any looping or jumping back to selected regions in Edit Audio Regions, that's for playing, not editing
Make the default initial region a little larger, it is almost always too small (but item 2 would reduce the need for this as the play head won't sometime jump back to the beginning of the region you just added.
Make the start of any new region start at the end of the previous region by default, user can edit later if needed.
Never automatically move the play head, either back, or looping, let the user have complete control of Play/Stop and play head position.
In stead of creating regions with start and stop, consider adding markers that indicate the start of a region and the end of the previous region. Then there's no need to ever resize regions. Allow the markers to be moved including during playback.

Basically I want to listen through a song once adding regions as I go without stopping, jumping back, looping selected regions, etc. Then I can go back and add colors and labels.

Maybe someday consider deriving regions from time stamp markers in the lyrics. This would take some logic to find suitable regions, but would be very nice.

Damir

jamsden Don't do any looping or jumping back to selected regions in Edit Audio Regions, that's for playing, not editing

You got it all back to front, that’s exactly what the EDIT AUDIO REGIONS is for and that’s to create audio regions not to play them, that’s the players job.

Damir

jamsden Using Space bar for Play/Stop as in other views

I agree with you on this , that would be much more conventional.

Damir

jamsden Make the start of any new region start at the end of the previous region by default, user can edit later if needed.

It does this already, if you select a region it starts from the beginning of that region which is the end of the previous region.

Damir

jamsden Never automatically move the play head, either back, or looping, let the user have complete control of Play/Stop and play head position.

You already have full control of playhead , and it won’t jump around or loop in a region , just don’t select a region to edit.

peter

Will consider that for version 4
How can you preview your loop points if no looping is possible in the region editor?
The default size is 4 bars at the selected tempo. I think that is a quite reasonable setting.
Can already be achieved by placing the playhead into the previous region and then tapping the + button.
The playhead represents the playback position. It is supposed to move automatically during playback. You can already disable the playhead following.
Not everyone uses continuous regions. I for example only define regions in parts that I want to repeat.

jamsden

Thanks!
I would do that while performing the song, not while editing the regions. Maybe have an option to preview loops on/off. I was having to do a lot of clicks while establishing the regions to unselect a region so it wouldn't repeat. That might be because I am trying to resize the previous region end and the start of the new region I just added while the playhead proceeds.
Ok.
But my use case is I'm listening and adding sections as I go. So the playhead is already beyond the previous section when I hit plus, so I have to adjust its start. I would like to be able to add all the sections with one straight through listen.
I had odd issues where the playback head would just jump backwards for no apparent reason. Maybe I'm adjusting regions the previous region while its playing and something on my magic mouse is causing it too skip back.
Agree, but markers can support that too. Empty regions between markers just wouldn't have a label.

Damir

I disagree with everything you suggest, this area is a creation of audio segments and not a practice your song area , it makes no sense to what you are suggesting , why don’t you just deselect the region and just play the song .
This way you won’t get any looping and the song will play from beginning to end the playhead won’t jump and you will get what you want.

Damir

jamsden In stead of creating regions with start and stop, consider adding markers that indicate the start of a region and the end of the previous region.

I’m sorry can you explain this a bit more clearly I do not understand your point to comment on it

Damir

jamsden Then there's no need to ever resize regions. Allow the markers to be moved including during playback.

Once I create a perfect region there is no need to edit it again anyway , perhaps I am missing something here.

Damir

jamsden Basically I want to listen through a song once adding regions as I go without stopping,

There is no way to you can create perfect loops on the run because ST3 does not recognise beats , it’s purely time based so you definitely need to stop select a loop then zoom in to accurately finish the loops and that’s why you have the automated playhead jumping back through all other loop points so you can complete the perfect loop that you have selected , once you are happy with that loop you choose another loop to focus on this process creates perfect jump points around your song.
Your idea is too rough to work on stage , yes perhaps a new loop can be inserted to a moving playhead position as a rough choice of inserting audio regions so then you grab the end points and perfect the loop but it has not been an issue just the way it is.

Damir

jamsden Maybe someday consider deriving regions from time stamp markers in the lyrics. This would take some logic to find suitable regions, but would be very nice.

This would never be accurate enough to be useful as timestamps are manually entered and don’t represent the audio backing track , I always hit my lyrics timestamps ahead of the beats so I see my lyrics settled and ready earlier.
But the idea of audio segments timestamps and name of loop to be able to be automatically transferred to the text editor would definitely be useful , all you do is load the lyrics and place the verses and choruses text under the appropriate audio loop segment timestamps and you have a very quick way of time stamping you lyrics in chunks , where you can always then do line timestamps if needed.
I believe ST4 might have a lot more capability to do all this , but time will tell.

AnthonyB

Damir

I was reading through this thread and initially also liked the idea of using timestamps to define audio regions until I read your point about wanting timestamped lyrics to 'load' slightly ahead of when you are at the respective part of the song so you have sufficient time to glance/read then sing.

That then got me thinking about the 2 main uses I'm seeing people wanting to use Audio Regions for and why some feature requests might not 'work' as they don't align with the original intended purpose of audio regions.

So I've seen people's desire to use Audio Regions effectively come down to these two reasons:

Define parts of the song so that during song playback you can skip to a section, repeat a section, etc.
Define parts of the song so that you have a simple visual cue at the top of the page as to where, during playback, you currently are in the song structure. You're in the zone and playing and have a 'oh crap, are we at the 2nd chorus going intoa Bridge or 3rd Chorus going into a double then outro?" type moment. Quick glance and you know where you are in the song.

My usage would definitely be Point 2. Someone like @Damir is Point 1. I'm sure there are people in both camps, or would even use the feature for both purposes.

Having already gone through the effort to timestamp lyric sheets, I'm not sure I would have the willpower to go back and then start defining audio regions for each song. I don't use Logic Pro (Windows user here, so I can't) so can't have my Markers exported with my stems for import into ST3.

Given I don't need precise timing for audio continuity, maybe there could be an option (or a different named feature that looks similar) that does use timestamped lines in the lyric sheet to define 'song regions' (thought I'd use a different name to see how it fits) that work as visual cues, but aren't going to be beat perfect for audio region jumping/looping?

Maybe you could actually have things like "Intro" and "Verse" in your lyric sheet, but they have a tag so they are hidden (but don't have to be? Maybe some people like seeing those section headers on their lyric sheets? I know I do.) and if they are timestamped, then they appear as 'Song region markers'?

Just spit-balling ways to make a feature, that actually 2 different functions with slightly differing requirements but also overlapping requirements, possibly work for everyone.