Midi

davey62

Hi, I am thinking of trying to use ST3 midi to control a guitar pedal. I currently connect/run my tracks from my ipad using a usbc to 1/4'' stereo breakout cable to my mixer. If I do not want to use a bluetooth connection from ipad to send midi to a guitar pedal, what would I need for a wired connection? Also, is there a way to use ST3 app to use midi without running a track? Such as a button(s). I also play in a band that doesn't use tracks but maybe having buttons on the lyric sheet to send midi would be helpful.

AnthonyB

davey62 If I do not want to use a bluetooth connection from ipad to send midi to a guitar pedal, what would I need for a wired connection?

I'd just be looking for a USB-C to XXX adapter for your iPad that gioves you the necessary plug-in points for your existing USB-to-audio cable, power, and then however you choose to connect to your guitar pedal.
You haven't specified what guitar pedal you have, or what interfaces it has for MIDI (USB? 5-pin DIN? TRS? Other?), so I can't really give you specifics on how you would connect your guitar pedal to your iPad. If you provide the specific model and what the MIDI interface option/s are, then people can help with more specific info.

I have an older Lightning iPad and use a Lightning to USB-A x 2 + Lightning adapter so I can still run power, but also have one USB port to connect audio to my mixer and another USB port to connect to a physical MIDI interface (CME H4 in my case https://www.cme-pro.com/h4midi-wc-usb-host-midi-interface/).

davey62 Also, is there a way to use ST3 app to use midi without running a track? Such as a button(s). I also play in a band that doesn't use tracks but maybe having buttons on the lyric sheet to send midi would be helpful.

To an extent. Again, being more specific on what you might want to achieve would help.
You could just use Lyric only song (i.e. no backing tracks) and have them autoscroll. You could embed on-load or on-start MIDI commands in it to send MIDI events when you load the song (lyric sheet) or start it. But if you aren't running backing tracks, then you can't timestamp lyric sheet therefore you can't do any time-specific events after that point as ST doesn't know where in the song your band actually is.
No, there are no MIDI trigger buttons in ST UI per se.

Damir

AnthonyB Also, is there a way to use ST3 app to use midi without running a track? Such as a button(s). I also play in a band that doesn't use tracks but maybe having buttons on the lyric sheet to send midi would be helpful.

I suppose this could be possible by using the audio segments buttons , but instead of using the audio you simply place a midi command you need at the head of every audio segment , basically same as start of song but every segment has this capability , this way you just hit the segment you need on screen and you activate those midi commands , this then gives you 24 instant triggers per song that can instantly control external devices plus you could also use them to get instant lyrics to suit if you select SOLO you get all midi commands to setup your solo needs with no lyrics needed but you might trigger a pdf to show you notation for the solo , the uses could be endless.
All you do is set a song length, select number of midi buttons/audio segments you need , then program a midi command on start of each audio segment and you have midi buttons to control devices, if you need lyrics as well just throw in the lyrics you need in that segment so now you have midi control buttons and lyrics as well without any backing audio , if you also need backing audio later , just load the audio and rearrange the audio segments and now all midi commands are already there and the lyrics you just change the starting and ending of the segment everything else is still there , if you entered synced lyrics you will need to redo them to suit the audio file , but this is easy at least your midi commands are retained and the actual text ,
All this idea of operation is to make the software not change too much but to be able to deliver the needs of musicians that have different needs by being flexible yet simple to operate .
Good logic !

davey62

AnthonyB

I am looking to purchase a Line 6 HX stomp that has 5 pin midi jacks. I am connecting my Ipad to a mixing board using a usbc from Ipad to a stereo breakout cable that has two 1/4" cables that go into two channels on my mixer to play tracks.
I know there are bt midi devices to connect to a guitar pedal but wondering what kind of hardware I'd need to still run the 1/4" cables and a wired option to the pedal. When playing with a live band without tracks I guess I was wondering if it would be easier to just quick tap a midi button on an ipad screen that I already use for lyrics than to look down and tap pedals. I have never used midi so I'm just thinking about options. Also looking at a Tonex pedal.

AnthonyB

Damir I suppose this could be possible by using the audio segments buttons , but instead of using the audio you simply place a midi command you need at the head of every audio segment , basically same as start of song but every segment has this capability , this way you just hit the segment you need on screen and you activate those midi commands , this then gives you 24 instant triggers per song

That is an awesomely creative idea!

@davey62 Back to your original thought about buttons to press - are you really going to want to take your hands off your instrument that often? I get that once or twice might be fine, but more than that, wouldn't foot pedals, or even an additional foot pedal MIDI controller to send the triggers to your guitar effects pedal, be better?
Again, don't know what you are doing, or how, so this is all conjecture!

Damir

AnthonyB that is already in place just move by foot to appropriate button and hit select/ start triggers the command if no audio is present , if you are using backing then you just select as normal.This way you can jump around selecting loops and hitting start triggers the midi or selects appropriate text it has no influence on audio as it has none.

AnthonyB

davey62 When playing with a live band without tracks I guess I was wondering if it would be easier to just quick tap a midi button on an ipad screen that I already use for lyrics than to look down and tap pedals.

I can't imagine using fingers, while playing an instrument, to press buttons on a screen to change effects to be easier than using your feet but you know your scenario and capabilities better than anyone!

davey62 Line 6 HX stomp that has 5 pin midi jacks. I am connecting my Ipad to a mixing board using a usbc from Ipad to a stereo breakout cable that has two 1/4" cables that go into two channels on my mixer to play tracks.
I know there are bt midi devices to connect to a guitar pedal but wondering what kind of hardware I'd need to still run the 1/4" cables and a wired option to the pedal.

OK, so my original answer stands. You could probably find a USB-C to Dual USB-C (i.e. a splitter) or USB-C to USB-C+USB-A adapter which lets you retain your current method of taking a stereo audio output to your mixer, and gives you a 2nd USB port to connect to a MIDI interface.
The type of adapter really depends on what ports you want to have available (which also includes the option to keep your iPad powered). There are hundreds on Amazon and eBay, and not all are equal. Once you know what you want, someone else might be able to recommend one they use successfully to achieve the same outputs.

The CME H4 I use is overkill for your needs. I use it because I'm using BT MIDI and also some wired MIDI. You could get away with the CME C2 cable (https://www.cme-pro.com/product/c2midi-pro/) if you wanted to keep it super simple. If you wanted to reduce wires and use more wireless, you could use the CME WIDI Bud Pro (https://www.cme-pro.com/widi-bud-pro/) pluigged into a USB-A port on whatever splitter you get for your iPad, and the CME WIDI Master (https://www.cme-pro.com/widi-master/) on the HX Stomp. If you went for a different FX pedal that has TRS MIDI ports, then you'd use the CME WIDI Jack (https://www.cme-pro.com/widi-jack/).

No, I don't work for CME 🙂 But I've been using their stuff for about a year after seeing some positive reviews and I haven't been disappointed. I've also found their support to be absolutely brilliant.

Damir

AnthonyB When playing with a live band without tracks I guess I was wondering if it would be easier to just quick tap a midi button on an ipad screen that I already use for lyrics than to look down and tap pedals.

I agree, that’s why I suggested to Peter to use audio segments in a smart way to help those in your situation, I do believe a lot of other musos are in the same boat, ST3 is already great with lyrics / audio segments , why not make audio segments more useful since they are there already and not everyone uses backing tracks but they do need lyrics , now you should also be able to use them for midi patch changes to setup a guitar FX or change LIGHTING manually to suit a verse or a chorus that also provides you with the lyrics , this should be possible . And it’s smart logic.

davey62

AnthonyB

Sorry for my ignorance but the links you attached are for usb/usbc splitters. My tracks are sent to my mackie mixing board from ipad usbc to 1/4" cables not usb. My mixer does not have usb channel inputs.

https://www.truegether.com/cablecreation-15ft-3-5mm-1-8-trs-to-dual-6-35mm-1-4-ts-mono-y-cable-splitter-cable-compatible-with-iphone-ipod-laptop-cd-players-power-amplifier-mixer-home-stereo-systems-4-5-meters-black/USER.716a9c5a-603d-4be5-af60-5c7f321ea312/listing.html

AnthonyB

JDSMUSIC

davey62 Sorry for my ignorance but the links you attached are for usb/usbc splitters. My tracks are sent to my mackie mixing board from ipad usbc to 1/4" cables not usb. My mixer does not have usb channel inputs.

I know 🙂

The spliters/adapters are to turn your sole USB-C port on your iPad into multiple ports. You would still use your existing USB-C to 1/4" cable WITH the adapter/splitter (well, depending on the splitter), as well as additional cables to connect to MIDI interface, power, whatever.

The link to the splitter above has confused me. Is that what you are currently using?
If so... you keep saying "ipad usbc to 1/4" cables" - are you plugging that 1/8" TRS plug into the headphone out of the iPad, or using a USB-C-to-female 1/8" adapter and THEN plugging the above 1/8"-to-dual 1/4" cable into that?

davey62

AnthonyB

The link to the splitter above is the one I am using. yes, I use an 1/8" female to usb adapter on it. Can you send me a photo/link of the splitter you are describing?

AnthonyB

davey62 All my iPads are 9th Gen and older so my adapter are all Lightning to 2xUSB-A + Lightning (for power). This is what I use (just for context) - https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/B0BZRYQJV4

Doing a quick search on Amazon, this is the sort of thing you might try - https://www.amazon.com.au/Multiport-Adapter-Charging-Converter-Chromebook/dp/B0DQGPLKD2
It has USB-C to USB-C + USB-A + HDMI
That was just the first USB-C based multiport adapter I found. You might not want HDMI but it has the USB-C and USB-A I was referring to. Keep searching and you might find one that has 3 x USB ports (mix A and C) to give you more flexibility.